The perm agg base coarse is basically a coarse 1-1/4 minus, and the perm agg top coarse is a coarse 5/8 minus (basically a 3/4 minus). 9 Things to Know About Landscaping with Decomposed Granite or DG It keeps their feet in the best shape of all the footings Ive dealt with. This size rock resembles lemons or grapefruits and provides a firm base for the driveway. Should I do the same thing, or should I do something different like sand or pea gravel? Use Gravel Or Crushed Limestone. A really interesting topic, and I have a question: is gravel 4/3 & 4/1 good as an alternative to fine sand in horse rooms, or is fine sand better? If the supplier charges by the yard, then the costs can be about $27 . Or is that an attachment you put on your own tractor? This is the best article I have read on this subject! However, later experience taught me that depending on the type of crusher dust, and how hard the ground is when properly prepared, the horses wont lie down on it anyway so this is an unknown factor. Oh, and even though I added a new portable shelter for them, so they could stand outside to eat, this rain cover did not prevent the gravel from sinking into the ground around the slow feeders by April; just from the wear and tear of their hooves without any rainfall on it. We have tons of experience in residential, commercial and industrial applications . It packs decently but also isnt as sharp edged so it gets used in beach areas where there will be plenty of bare feet. HOW are these plants, actually helping or addressing an imbalance in your soil? How to Make a Gravel Parking Area | Hunker 2. Lake County, IL Crushed Limestone Gravel | Bulk Limestone Pavers Best Types of Gravel for Driveways - Gardening Channel Sorry I havent seen or experimented with stall footing. So the amount of rainfall was certainly unusual. Thanks for letting us know . The next winter, you will need to add another 4-6 inches of 3/4-inch minus gravel. Its holding up well though and perhaps they will only need to re-do it every 3-5 years now; since theres such a good base on it now. Horse was very lame. All of the rock based products are close to the same price being within 10 dollars a yard of each other. Of course you can always start with that and if its not enough, then add more on top. BUT, what am I going to put on their paddock surface to create a paddock footing with adequate drainage? Stabilizing a Muddy Road - Rural Home Technology I want a one time solution with not a massive upkeep. A couple of months ago (prior to reading this) I leveled the walkout paddock area and laid pea gravel 6 deep under the roof and 4 beyond which will be exposed to a lot of rain in winter. And I had to do that every year, for 4 years, until I finally got my friend Mitchell to come in and do it right. Bulk crushed stone and gravel prices are $10 to $50 per ton on average. The other way to look at the weed issue is from a soil ecology perspective. Thinking about limestone gravel or C30 sand. Manure and leaves also break down quickly in the rain, so you must clear them off your gravel daily. Perhaps just 3/4 minus gravel laid 4 inches deep and 2 inches of crusher dust (1/4 minus) on top would be sufficient?? One thing everyone does seem to agree on, is that if you are using crusher dust or pea gravel, its best to scrape off the topsoil (mud) first and get it down to the hard soil surface, then lay your footing. Having said all that, if you have an active herd like mine and youve got an area thats sheltered from rain theyre still going to move it around and carve it out over the winter. I had my area done 2 years ago. When the two materials are used together, the fine material fills in the voids left by the coarse material. But that is the law. If your horses are restricted to a small area, they may then start pulling on the cloth to play with it. The two layers lock together and when compacted, created a smooth surface for turf to be laid on top of. How Did The Paddock Hold Up Over The Year? So, how do you fix and dry up a wet yard? What is your thoughts of the grids and french drains? 1. Thanks so much for your article. Hi Jini, its been almost a year since I did my paddock, I used your recommended amounts/measurements, minus the Nilex barrier cloth, and its been great. Listen To Your Horse Energy, Body & Environment, Stories from Animal Communicator Ginny Jablonski, Trailer Learning (Play) When you Dont have a Horse Trailer, Horses Give Livestream Demo of Animal Communication, Big Mama Aude: Heal Your Heart-Belly Wounding, How to Prepare Bone Broth & Give the Bones to Your Dogs (safely! I live in western Oregon and am oh-so-tired-of-mud and looking for an affordable mud free paddock recipe, so to speak. 6. The only other consideration is if you want to bring a heavy truck on the paths in that case you definitely need to go with a layer of 3-inch minus road base, then whatever you want on top of that for your horses hooves. These are just a few of the many ways limestone can be used: 1. To ensure adequate drainage for the stable when using any type of flooring, elevate the top of the stall floor at least 12 inches above the outside ground level. An easy way to tell the difference is that crushed drain rock is usually variegated (the grains will have multiple colors) while a quarried rock will mostly consist of the same color hue. And then the cloth gets moved around by their hooves. As I have 2 horses I intend to build a small turnout paddock for the winter months. Heres all the things I did not anticipate, so you can benefit from my learning curve: 1. Adding sand won't work and will likely worsen your sticky situation. GAH this is the bane of my existence! Make sure you dont get smooth-edged crusher though it needs to have the jagged/irregular edges to pack properly. I recently joined a horse track group and there was a post on fleece lasagna and how well it works in boggy areas , gateways and lane ways! Go ahead and compact again. Id love to see it in person. You have a Horse Herb & Supplement Shoppe?! Extremely muddy yard -- what do I put down? - DIY Home Improvement Forum Problem is, it doesnt pack down the way Id like. Angular Crushed Rock, very stable and suitable for paddocks. That said, you pretty much have to see the different types and as was mentioned by someone else, you have to know how the surface below it will effect it. First layer of rock should be 40mm crushed rock, with no fines in it. This is where we can choose to support our horses in a wholistic manner. Only a few dont fall through. Well, I laid the paddock footing in August. I guess it goes back for centuries in the European countries and the lady that wrote the list was from Scotland. However, horses hooves are way more punchy than car or truck tires. 10 Ways To Cover Up Mud In Your Backyard - Your Guide For Simple Living One thing that I did and would highly recommend is after having the 3 minus delivered we rented a 1000 lb plate compactor and compacted the arena surface for a full week, many, many, many times. Rip Rap (R3 - R8) Crushed Stone The only other option I can think of, is to save your money on the material underneath and put that towards having custom-cut mats that fill the stall, wall-to-wall in one piece. https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/equine-permaculture-in-rainy-climates-system-for-sustainable-pastures/, great info, i really appreciate you sharing with others as it takes time to post such info with pictures, too. With an older or sedate herd, maybe youd only have to top up once ever 2-3 years. In that case, I think it would depend on how your drainage is set up from your stalls A barn with good drainage probably requires a different material under the mats, than a stall with poor/no drainage. Thanks so much for sharing your methods and experience. One of the most common uses of crushed limestone is in laying driveways. We built it on a base of 1" crushed limestone at the recommendation of the builder. This work can be done with a shovel, but it is laborious work. Your email address will not be published. I have also not had to top it up in any way, although I pick manure daily, and also harrow it weekly as I dont want to mess up my base by having holes in my sand from the horses playing out there! However, on the flip side of that argument, here's what a Farrier has to say about why she prefers crusher dust: "As a farrier, my favourite footing in this area is crusher dust. So you watch where water flows when its raining, and then scrape and lay your gravel during summer when its dry. If you need to install a drain or culvert heres my handy step-by-step guide to install a French drain. Installing a crushed limestone driveway can set homeowners back by about $1.25 to $2 per square foot of driveway space. Now lay a layer of large rock or recycled concrete (3 inches wide or larger rock) on top of the Nilex barrier, about 5 inches deep. We just had our stable built, with excavation down to the hard soil. In hindsight, even if I could not afford to remove the topsoil and lay down the proper layers first, I should have dumped 3/4 inch minus gravel directly on the grass (at least 3 inches) and then dumped 1/4 inch minus crusher dust directly on top of the gravel (at least 2 inches deep). The best type of gravel for the top layer of a gravel driveway includes crushed shale, limestone, granite and concrete. Work these rocks into. Will last a lot longer. And I will move them to the field next to it. This concentrates it where the horses will actually be standing/walking. INC. - Eighty Four 1016 Pennsylvania 519 Eighty Four, Pennsylvania 15330 (724) 222-4303 Get Directions Kirby Agri 500 Running Pump Road Lancaster, Pennsylvania 17601 717-229-2541 Get Directions It can also be used to level stepping-stones. Our horses stay in the barn overnight in winter and are out during the day, and this is reversed in summer so the horses graze when its cooler at night. 2 inches equals .167 feet Their paddock is 8000 sq feet, so cost is definitely an issue. Ive also not had one issue of gravel puncturing or injuring their soles when horses hooves have a place to dry out regularly, and they have a variety of surfaces to choose from, in my experience, their hooves and soles harden up and just take care of themselves. Sometimes you have to do some research into what to lay down below it. The Ultimate Dog-Friendly Landscaping Guide - HomeAdvisor Our farrier does not love the pea gravel. Ideally, gravel should be 3/8" but 3/4" would also work. There are many opinions of course as to which is best, in fact it can be a bit overwhelming at times so I would appreciate any guidance. Now, keep in mind that Dr. Swinkers advice is not tailored for a heavy rainfall area. If you can afford concrete I would 100% go with that!! Crushed Limestone Driveway Pros and Cons - Designing Idea 1.5 tons can cover one cubic yard. Do not just go buy geo-textile cloth from your local nursery or hardware store (tried that, doesnt work!). I have hired a contractor with a huge tracked skid steer who specialises in fine grading to fill my trench back in and grade and scrape their entire paddock so that it has a nice gentle slope. BUT your depth must also be in feet, not inches. If theyre coming end of April, youre well over the worst of it. Paulo from Winnipeg Drywall and Stucco in Winnipeg. Crushed stone is the world's most basic mineral commodity. Can anyone comment on the use and longevity of products like Lighthoof? Crushed limestone drive from the concrete driveway to the tractor shed, stalls were crushed limestone too. Dont be tempted then to just throw more gravel down, thinking its got a good base now. Horses pulverize the manure on top of the gravel and very difficult to pick up the manure. For one tone of crushed limestone, you would pay around $25 to $35. I also found it really helpful to install a French Drain in my current paddock to help funnel the water off/away from the paddock and this made a huge difference in the effectiveness of my paddock surface. Virginia Limestone Supplier | Purchase Limestone in Virginia | Get Quote The most common approach to firming up a muddy road is to add gravel. I think the punchiness of horses hooves disturbs the gravel so much, that all that needs to happen is for them to punch through to the geotextile in a very small spot and then that quickly enlarges. The process involves breaking of collected rocks down to the specific sizes with the help of different rock crushers/machines. Rubber Mats Just beginning to figure out what my best plan is. . Will dogs poop on pea gravel? Introduction Video: Customer Reviews: Product Videos: Categories. Mix the Soil-Cement. I asked a phd in geology who has worked a full career in geology. This year added more 57s, more screenings. I live in Maple Ridge and I am about to attempt this for my two horses on a rental property We have been using cheap quarried chalk (local limestone) and compacting it on site. For example, the price for one yard is around $40 at Mains Landscape Supply. I know several stables that just dump fresh crusher dust on their paddocks every year to replenish the surface because they didnt follow the steps I outlined above, they just dump the crusher right on the earth. What can I use as a surface layer that will pack down fairly hard and not get cut up by hooves? A muddy backyard in a small property can be solved with ease by covering the mud with concrete. It isnt something the horses prefer to roll in but give them options on a rainy day and they will stand on it over most other footings. I would not use it. It consists of a coarse aggregate base and a finer cover layer. BUT the paddock area in front of the shelters is going to get a lot of traffic, and will quickly turn into a mud pit. e.g: 500 square feet x .5 feet depth = 250 cubic feet. Youre welcome And how terribly EXCITING!! They also know WHEN to eat a plant some are not toxic at first growth in Spring and only become toxic as they approach maturity. So they tear around a lot, wrestle, lunge and pivot etc. In order to alleviate mud problems, consider laying a base of #3 or #4 Limestones on top of which you can layer 2B or 2A . How Can Animal Communicators NOT be Vegan? It would probably be fine in a drier climate but on the Wet Coast, it isnt ideal. Google+; It can pack into a hard surface with limited drainage capacity. It worked well for them as they were just there for a few years. If the hay does get on it, it isnt like sand for colic concerns that Ive ever heard of. Rip rap is an aggregate that will perform in the harshest outdoor conditions. Crushed rock with fines is called Crushed rock 40mm minus. The product is commonly used as erosion control, as a heavy drainage material, as a stabilizer or for landscaping. Can be used for landscaping, back fill and mixing concrete. If you do it right the first time, you may only have to do the underlayers once (as long as you keep organic matter off your paddock surface) and then top up with crusher dust every couple of years. Ok so Ive spent some time thinking about this, but I dont think youre gonna like my answer! I also dont worry about having my horses loose when the machinery is here. I was interested to see if it would work, as a woman had written in (who also lives in this Pacific Northwest climate) to tell me that its never worked for her horses. The other stuff is too loose and just moves out of the way like pea gravel. I forget the size but its small enough to fall through the manure fork. Kimberly, Oooh thats fantastic Kimberly! I have a paddock area that has nothing but mud now, especially after heavy rains and whenever the snow melts. The biggest issue is the immense amount of dust generated in the stalls. They said it packs down better than pea gravel in the rain, there are less of the tiny stones to get stuck in the horses hooves, and its easy to shovel manure off of. So the only surface Ive seen work is concrete. It makes total sense though that it would be slippery when wet/freezing. If you have hard ground underneath, you may be able to get away with 2-3 layers of gravel: Bottom: Large roadbase (3 minus) And that should be no problem for their hooves either its such a short time. He says it grinds away at their soles and bars in particular. I heard the local racetrack likes to use it, but they are also grooming the track daily. crushed limestone for muddy yard. We rented the compactor from United Rentals, it is a seperate machine, but we did use a tractor to lift it off of the trailer that we brought it home with, it was heavy! Like Hoffmans? I am considering using 3 deep of recycled 1minus concrete directly on top of the fresh scraped and graded ground compacted with his skidsteer and then adding 3 deep of crusher dust or sechelt sand to the top.. 250 cubic feet divided by 27 = 9.25 cubic yards. Examples of materials used for crushed stone include limestone and granite. wearing surface. . We have a rescue donkey and rescue OTTB that love to roll in mud but after 4 days of rain, its too much mud! 2. My horses are surrounded by toxic plants not one of them has ever become sick. Although this can occasionally be effective, there is a saying in the trade that "adding a bucket of gravel to a bucket of mud just gets you a bigger bucket of mud.". I would suggest a coarse, crushed quarry rock or crushed drain rock for a base rather than drain rock or pea gravel, especially for an area getting a lot of traffic. But again, after researching, I think thats an issue of the existing surface, how much is used, and what the resulting footing is like. Paul. The finer material compacts easily but will move under heavy traffic. It can also be called quarter minus, or flume sand. By February, all the horses hooves were still in great condition (they are also fed low sugar hay, which makes a huge difference to hoof health) and the surface was still in good shape. Im going to pick his oh-so-experienced brain and see if he knows anything we dont already know or has some tips or tweaks that make a world of difference. Et voila! I have already tried to scrape down a few layers last year and dig a trench through the center of their paddock but it hasnt worked as i didnt grade the area well enough.. Crushed Stone Delivery Cost - In 2023 - The Pricer Both areas were destroyed in a couple of months once the rains started the cloth was either sticking up all over the place (the other woman said her horses would then grab it in their teeth and pull on it we just cut it off), or it had disappeared into the muck. Which Grade of Crushed Limestone Is Right for You - Port Aggregates Crushed limestone gravel is relatively inexpensive and makes for an attractive, natural looking but durable walking surface. You may always install. So much good information (all based on experience with horses, which is good). Gravel is extremely simple to put on lawns and offers a long-term solution. I have a small boarding facility, so I have 12 runs to deal with and budget is a concern, but I also know having to do it twice costs more because of mistakes lol. Plain pea gravel or limestone costs $28 to $45 per ton. Doing so can decrease the accumulation of dust inside your home and make the space useful as another living space like a porch or even a mini court for your kids. When choosing rock for the top layer, choose "traffic bound" or "dense-grade" gravel. You might also want to look into the Paddock Paradise, or, Walking Track system. https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/equine-permaculture-in-rainy-climates-system-for-sustainable-pastures/, https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/adventures-in-culvert-drainage-for-my-horse-paddock/, Ginny Interviews Jini for the Interspecies Evolution Podcast, Montaros Emancipation My Freedom is Your Freedom, Heart Opening Meditation with the Herd & Land, Montaros Journey: Healing the Wounded Angry Masculine, Messages from Burdock (Burrs), Raven & The Herd, The Herd Out My Window Esoteric Musings, Laminitis, Cushings, Founder Healing Session for Your Horse, Pain, Injury, Competition Brainwashing & Dissociation, The Geography of Belonging Horses & Love in Zimbabwe. And what you used. I really appreciate the knowledge you shared. The same problem occurs when you shovel manure. Thanks for the discussion. I have been on two rental properties and each time didnt think it was worth doing the geotextile, but even if you only stay 2 years, its worth it. The same Farrier I quoted above also says: It locks together and makes a very firm surface with just enough give to allow for maximum traction. 74.9 million tons used for cement manufacturing and the share of limestone are significant in it. Excellent article, and appreciate the before and after pics. The bottom layer is called a permeable aggregate base coarse and the top is a permeable aggregate top coarse. NOTICE I ended up calling a guy with a tractor anyway! Crusher dust is gravel that has been crushed to the size of 1/4 or less. Again, this article is fantastic! We put down road base then put pea gravel on top. Then I added 4 inches of 3/4 inch minus gravel, and then 2 inches of crusher dust. I have 3 acres and am looking to create a drylot for my 6 sheep Leaning towards the princess option, or somewhere inbetween. A clean crushed stone with an average size of 3/4 . 2. Contact Us, How to Fix a Muddy Yard (Prevent Water Build-Up Tips). When choosing gravel, pea gravel, or limestone gravel, most experts say you should get crushed rock particles no larger than 3/4-inch, or they are not comfortable for the horses to stand on. I tried sharp sand one year on top of hardstanding but it doesnt rot down and just gets dirty and heavy to shift. Just purchased Nov of 17 and boy it was a wet muddy mess for my 3 because I only had one month to get so much done before I could move them in. Your email address will not be published. (Aggregate = rocks; permeable = allows water to pass through.). I have been debating over whether i need Geo-textile or not, as some areas are fairly hard but some seem to have some clay Thanks so much Eve, for stopping by and adding your wisdom/experience to this conversation much appreciated! It doesnt matter how much you scrape and pack, your gravel (even 3 road base!) My least favourite footing is hogfuel and Id probably have them stand in mud over hogfuel because when hogfuel is new, it is very acidic and it etches out the sole of the foot, leaving the foot more vulnerable (Ive seen hooves so bad on it that a hoofpick can poke through the sole easily.